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This board is multifaceted, crossing various topics from New Age, spirituality, metaphysical, psychology, physical issues, relationships, emotions, self-help and more. It is created for those who seek change and desire to empower themselves, to live life as an expression of who they really are in unconditional love. If you think/feel that your life and this world full of denial, fear and unlovingness is totally opposite what you desire, it is no coincidence that you are here.

To say that this board will be controversial is an understatement as it goes against almost everything society presently believes to be true about emotions, feelings, life and love. But then why wouldn't it be controversial if the desire and goal is the opposite of what is presently being experienced! To empower yourself, you need to be open to challenge everything you believe to be true, especially about love, life, emotions and feelings and also be willing to end your denials of self.

I openly share the knowledge, tools, messages and insights that I've gained through sixteen years of intensive personal experience and in working with others on their journey. Feel free to visit the various forums and posts and to also add your personal experiences, comments and questions. It is my intent that the ideas and works that will be discussed within this forum will not only expand your consciousness, but also activate your emotions and touch your heart.

In love, light and life,
John Rieger aka Shenreed

| My Profile | | My Books | | Saysame- My Blogs | | The Heart Centre - Forums | | info---at---shenreed.com |



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theheartcentre Profile
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Registered: 06-2003
Location: Toronto, Canada
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501-06 Conditional & Unconditional Love


Hi Everyone,

I have another topic for you that�s going set a few of you spinning and that is unconditional love. Unless you are aware, Unloving Light and conditional Love is easily confused with Unconditional Love. Unloving Light, either by careful use of words or by omission will confuse, control and manipulate the ignorant who believe that they are unloving or selfish if they think about themselves or dare to express themselves, especially their feeling and emotions.

Let me give you a simple example of words you hear mouthed all the time by religions and also by by those in New Age / Spirituality and such. The phrase is, �to love unconditionally, one must accept everything and love it without conditions.� While there is truth in that statement, it is twisted and is a definition of conditional love. It is by the simple twist and or omission of words that unconditional love is changed to conditional love. The statement should read, �to love unconditionally one must accept and love everything of self, without conditions. The word that was omitted in the first statement was �self� and it was replaced with �it,� (implying that �it� is something outside of self) and this is the KEY.

Unloving Light has double standards. If you challenge the person who made the first statement and use their words back at them, watch their reaction. If you say to them, �if that statement is the truth, then to prove that you are unconditional love, and that you �walk your talk� you must accept and love everything I do or say. You also cannot debate or deny anything I do or say to you including this statement because, �to love unconditionally, one must accept everything and love it without conditions.� (I�m smiling here) Watch them twist and turn and search to change their statement, to re-define, or to insinuate that you heard wrong or misinterpreted what they said or what they meant to say. Why did they get antsy? Because, if they follow their own rules, YOU would be CONTROLLING them, BUT if you blindly believed their definition and rule to be true, THEY are CONTROLLING you.

Now to be fair, I�ll give unloving light the same opportunity to challenge my statement. But Hey! There is nothing in the second statement that implies or has anything to do with the other person. �to love unconditionally one must accept and love everything of self, without conditions.� They can only catch me not �walking my talk� when I deny loving myself, which is about �me� controlling and manipulating myself and has nothing to do with me trying to control or manipulate them. Now if I love myself unconditionally, how can I possibly give another conditional love? And if everyone loved themselves, unconditionally, how could they give others conditional love? Impossible! Are you beginning to catch on and clue in, to this thing called DENIAL?

Love, Light and Life
John Rieger/Shenreed
"Healing begins in the Heart"

PS; You may want to read the post I did in �food for thought� on �Duality and Polarity.�

Last edited by theheartcentre, 12/Jun/2003, 10:32 am
10/Jun/2003, 3:54 pm Link to this post Send Email to theheartcentre   Send PM to theheartcentre
 
OSheen Profile
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Re: 501-06 Conditional & Unconditional Love


I AGREE with you wholeheartedly!!!

Not long ago I had the experience of emotional burnout. I was always a kind of free counsellor to people, always the one who was more compromising because I seemed more flexible, etc. I realized that I had been buying into that thinking of accepting everything and anything, and I had created a situation where I had absolutely no idea how to recieve! I had become so used to giving, and eventually I think it turned into a habit rather than a choice. One has to be strong enough to set guidelines of what one wants to experience with other people, and if those expectations are not met then the choice must be made to step away from an emotional investment in that situation regardless of who it is. It does not mean that Love is not present for the other person ... just that it is present for the self as well and because of that, you are willing to admit what you desire from another person and go looking for it.

Sorry, I am really tired and I think this post is getting *fumbled* ....
15/Jun/2003, 5:37 am Link to this post Send Email to OSheen   Send PM to OSheen
 
theheartcentre Profile
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Re: 501-06 Conditional & Unconditional Love


Hi Osheen,

EXPECTATIONS was a key word I picked out of a line in your post "and if those expectations are not met then" as
expectations are "conditional" love. Setting any form of boundries with its programs, rules, limits and judgments
is what we have been doing whether we're conscious of it or not or we think we are empowering ourselves by going to the other end of the teeter-totter of the experience.

Regards
John
"Healing begins in the Heart"
15/Jun/2003, 10:23 am Link to this post Send Email to theheartcentre   Send PM to theheartcentre
 
OSheen Profile
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Re: 501-06 Conditional & Unconditional Love


Hi.

When I refer to expectations, I do not refer to expectations from specific individuals. Rather, an expectation from the universe that my desires, if they are true to who I am, will be met. That includes a desire for a particular kind of friendship/romance/etc. I have a right to expect my desire will be fulfilled, yet I do not have the right to demand which individual will fulfill it. As our mainstream society stands now in regard to romance, for instance, we come across an individual who has dazzling eyes, or a beautiful body, or a great laugh. Something that attracts us initially. Then, we come to know them, and we come to form a kind of bond. When that bond is being formed, we bring out our "formula" of what we want in a relationship and we try to shove the person into that, even when they most obviously do not fit. It is like we go around hiding our formula until we "catch" someone, then we whip it out when they are not looking emoticon What happens with those people who believe they are loving unconditionally is that they begin accepting the fact that this person doesn't fit into their formula ... and they begin saying, "that is okay, I love you any way" and they sacrifice their true desire for a certain kind of relationship so that they can remain in the one they are in. Yet now they justify it. But what happens is they start to resent the other person, then they feel guilty about the resentment.

Now, if we admit to ourselves before hand what it is we desire in a given type of relationship, we will know it when it is present and we will have no need to squish someone into our formula. For example, I know that I want a relationship with someone who is willing to be emotionally open ... so if I find myself with someone who is not giving me that I can ask them if that is something they would like to experience ... and if it isn't, then I can move on. At that point, the relationship is free to become somthing else ...it is free to evolve into a different kind of friendship, and take the form it was meant to take naturally. There is no force, only willing choice. Yes, there is judgement in that. We cannot escape judgement, regardless of what the Gurus say. Even the attempt to reliquish judgement is a judgement against judgement. So, given that we cannot escape it (except in death, and if you believe in a higher soul then death itself becomes a judgement against life on earth) we must use it as a tool to determine what is authentic to us, what is honest for all involved, what will do the least damage, and what will allow everyone the opportunity to be free for themselves. I will not float about life hoping someone comes along that will provide me with a judgement free opportunity. Instead, I will state directly to the universe what is true to myself and wait for its arrival ... letting go of that which does not speak to my soul with love and gratitude for the learning experience.

Unconditional Love. Well, I feel that unconditional love occurs when the act of loving itself is what fulfills you and not the acknowlegement of the love, nor even the return. This frees us, because we are then open to loving whomever we choose ... and do not rely upon their emotions or choices to determine ours. In other words, MY ability to love is not based on anothers ability to love me.


Agape,
OSheen

(Cool topics, by the way)
15/Jun/2003, 7:13 pm Link to this post Send Email to OSheen   Send PM to OSheen
 


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